Police confiscated my 150 year old muzzle loader.

[Tomo]

tonight's Evening Standard. Apparently antique firearms are now only owned by gangs and criminals.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/ga ... 67108.html

[Stuck]

I think stating they are "now only owned by criminals" is pushing the original article somewhat.

[Spiggy]

AlthoughI did retain a very old family heirloom for display above the fireplace purposes. This gun was a double barrelled muzzle loader that used copper percussion caps to fire it. I don't believe that these caps are available any more even if I wanted them ( which I don't ). Also, one of the guns nipples for locating a cap is broken off, so, all in all, it is only suitable as an ornament.

That gun is unambiguously an antique firearm kept as a curio or ornament and is therefore completely exempt from all the provisions of the various firearms acts. I am appalled but not surprised, given the abysmal knowledge of firearms exhibited by many police officers, that they threatened to prosecute you. I know I am coning to this debate a little late but if you are still having problems please PM me and I may be assist with the correct words to be used in a formal letter to the police.

As it happens I was required to attend Dunstable police station this morning for the purpose of being charged for owning this gun without a permit. I am scheduled to appear at Bedford Magistrates Court in two weeks time in order to lodge a plea. Bizarrely both the police and the CPS pressed me at length to produce the permit I surrendered thirty years ago when a change of location required me to cease shooting and sell the shotgun I then owned. This seemed to be in order to establish if my permit had been revoked ; it had not, I surrendered it of my own volition. Your help would be much appreciated, all the more so since having retired and returned to the countryside I wish to take up shooting once more.

[M99]

Morning.
Firstly you need professional advice now, before court as this has a mandatory custodial sentence. IainWR may offer some help, had you been an NRA member he would have been your first port of call. Alas I suggest a decent solicitor who understands these things http://clivereessolicitor.com Clive is one of the good guys and I suggest you ring him Tuesday morning without fail.

I don't wish to worry you unduly, but this is a potentially serious situation and you need legal advice and not advice off a forum. I am sure Iain, will add anything of worth to the thread and I suggest you take note of his advice.

Mike

[ovenpaa]

(e) Shotguns and punt guns chambered for the following cartridges (expressed in imperial measurements): 32 bore, 24 bore, 14 bore, 10 bore (2 and 2 inch only), 8 bore, 4 bore, 3 bore, 2 bore, 1 bore, 1 ¼ bore and 1 ½ bore, and vintage punt guns and shotguns with bores greater than 10. It also includes vintage (pre-1939) rifles in these bores.

Thanks for this, amigo. It seems like muzzle loaders are exempt. Cheers !

12 bore is not listed which is reasonably common in muzzle loaders so you need to confirm the exact bore of the one seized. A picture really would be good and fingers crossed it goes OK for you.

[1066]

(e) Shotguns and punt guns chambered for the following cartridges (expressed in imperial measurements): 32 bore, 24 bore, 14 bore, 10 bore (2 and 2 inch only), 8 bore, 4 bore, 3 bore, 2 bore, 1 bore, 1 ¼ bore and 1 ½ bore, and vintage punt guns and shotguns with bores greater than 10. It also includes vintage (pre-1939) rifles in these bores.

Thanks for this, amigo. It seems like muzzle loaders are exempt. Cheers !

12 bore is not listed which is reasonably common in muzzle loaders so you need to confirm the exact bore of the one seized. A picture really would be good and fingers crossed it goes OK for you.

If it's a muzzle loader, surely it's not chambered for any cartridge no matter what the calibre?

[ovenpaa]

Muzzle loader... good point and time for another coffee

[Christel]

I could be totally wrong here...would it be worth calling headquarters in Harpenden and ask to speak to one of the chaps in the firearms licensing department?

Ask for advise?

[IainWR]

What, precisely, have you been charged with - ie what does it say on the written charge?

[1066]

Check out Chapter 8 of this: Home Office Guidance



(a) All muzzle-loading firearms;



Thanks for this, amigo. It seems like muzzle loaders are exempt. Cheers !

Hi Spiggy - Are you sure it's a muzzle loader? Could it be a be a blackpowder hammer gun, possibly with an under lever or other odd breech locking action.

Something similar to this, if you've not had a good poke about with it for many years it might be easy to confuse.
http://www.dogsanddoubles.com/2010/07/a ... re-part-1/

http://merzantiques.com/photo/very-scar ... ng-shotgun

http://www.icollector.com/Rare-Pauly-sy ... _i12499301

During the transition period from about 1860 -1890 many good quality muzzle loading shotguns were converted to breech loaders.

Just a thought.
A photo would help greatly.