best practical shotgun

[techguy]

Nope, it's not available here yet..There are some issues with it from what I hear.

Plus the limiting factor is the magazine, or rather the capacity of it..

[gasman]

I use a benelli M2 now, mainly because it requires less cleaning. i used to have an SX3, which is light weight, and soft to shoot recoilwise, but needs cleaning regularly if you want it to cycle properly, especially if you use fibre wad cartridges. this is true for most gas action cycled shotguns.
The Benelli M2 however is inertia action cycled, has no gas ports or pistons to clean and therefore is generally more reliable, as long as you use pokey cartridges,( or you can get lower powered recoil spring kits from Taran Tactical to enable it to cycle lower powered shells.).all the muck, gases,lead & wad particles go completely down the barrel and not through a gas port into the action.
The down side of the M2 compared to the SX3 is that its heavier, both in recoil and weight, and more expensive to buy new.
a good but cheaper alternative to the M2 is a Stoeger M3000,(stoeger is owned by Benelli) which uses a Benelli type inertia bolt, looks practically identical to the M2, but about half its price.
they all need mods to the loading port , lifting gate etc to enable fast twin/ quadloading, except the Beretta 1301, which has been factory modded , but you're back to a gas action again, and they are quite short in the stock length for most people.
as already stated, go to a few PSG shoots and ask to try several guns you like, the differences between them is surprising.

[Chuck]

Nope, it's not available here yet..There are some issues with it from what I hear.

Plus the limiting factor is the magazine, or rather the capacity of it..

Interesting, any more info.

i know mag capacity is 7 max. You have to remeber that inTurkland all the PSG / club stuff you do in the UK is alien to them here - these shotguns are all designed for hunting, not competition - hence the small capacity magazines.

In saying that my CZ HC-P is rifle accurate (made in Turkey for CZ )

[Sixshot6]

Nope, it's not available here yet..There are some issues with it from what I hear.

Plus the limiting factor is the magazine, or rather the capacity of it..

Interesting, any more info.

i know mag capacity is 7 max. You have to remeber that inTurkland all the PSG / club stuff you do in the UK is alien to them here - these shotguns are all designed for hunting, not competition - hence the small capacity magazines.

In saying that my CZ HC-P is rifle accurate (made in Turkey for CZ )

But those Dagger pumps sold in canada have 6 and 11 round mags which is ideal so they must have some idea.

[Lead-Fouling]

Do not, i repeat DO NOT buy a Hatsan Escort for PSG

Why?

Not everyone is in it to win it. What's the point of having the same gear as the best if you simply don't have the time to dedicate to compete with them? I like PSG because I love the adrenaline of it I don't really forsee my self as a dedicated / top level competitor (that's what DTL is for )

Buy the gun you enjoy shooting, there's nothing wrong with walt (especially if it saves you over a grand!). Even if that means rocking up with a VEPR-12 Just my 2 pence.

You might not want/expect to win, but coming last every time because of your equipment, not because of your own abilities, is massively demoralising for most people.

Shooting a tube fed gun in PSG is very much dependant on how fast you can load the thing and both the original Hatsan AND the MPA are slow as frozen sh!t after the provider has been fed a diet of chilled molasses and road tar. They are NOT suitable guns for PSG, unless you are a machocist and enjoy being last in every match (unless of course everyone shooting is using a Hatsan, then that really would be a test of loading skill!).

There are other guns of similar price to the new Hatsan which have normal loading gates and will not be a handicap the Hatsan is. No need for anyone to get their knickers in a twist if they have one, there is nothing wrong with Hatsans for clays/pest control etc, if fact the ones i've seen a very reliable in function, they're just not suited for anything that requires fast loading. Simple as that.

Thanks for the!clarification!

[Chuck]

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2015 ... ed-canada/

Turkey has a long tradition of gunmaking - used to be (literally) a cottage industry. Now they are mainly co-operatives from various regions.

We visited the Huglu factory years ago when they made a trap gun for the missus (made to measure from scratch). Toured the factory and even had dinner at the house of the bloke who made the stock from a lump of walnut..

All that fancy etching is done by hand.

[techguy]

Nope, it's not available here yet..There are some issues with it from what I hear.

Plus the limiting factor is the magazine, or rather the capacity of it..

Interesting, any more info.

i know mag capacity is 7 max. You have to remeber that inTurkland all the PSG / club stuff you do in the UK is alien to them here - these shotguns are all designed for hunting, not competition - hence the small capacity magazines.

In saying that my CZ HC-P is rifle accurate (made in Turkey for CZ )

No more info i'm afraid, just what I was told second hand. EB were meant to be supplying one as a prize for the NRA practical shotgun series, but there were problems with it (so I was told).. if I find out any more I will let you know..

7 isn't enough when you're competing against others with 10+ in a mag. I'd still like to get my hands on one, and see what it is like though. I have a Hatsan escort S2 pump, and for the money it's a brilliant shotgun. Build quality is surprisingly good too.

Still not as quick to load as my Benelli Supernova.. which would be my personal recommendation for a pump for PSG.

FWIW, for a semi for PSG, budget option would be a Stoeger M3000, or if you have money to play with then get an M2.

Disclaimer: I have a Supernova, Stoeger M3000 and a Bora :)

[Demonic69]

Sometimes I'm tempted to go over to Turkey and have a chat with someone about building a proper PSG semi. The M2 is OK; semi-reliable with plenty of trick-parts but it needs work out of the box to make it competition ready and it's expensive. There isn't a single shotgun I've seen that doesn't want some work to be able to load 2/4 easily.
If one of these Turks could manage something with a low-walled receiver, opened and lowered to allow quads to drop in easily, a decent lifter that doesn't bite and stays up, out of the way and only moves down when it needs to (anyone know why the lifter/loading gate has to cover the port all the time?). Decent sized bolt handle, bolt release that can be hit without having to take your hand off the grip, big safety etc. Stock options, pistol grip, collapsible etc., a fore-end that is smoothed to facilitate loading. Good choice of magazine extensions Yada Yada.

I'm surprised Benelli hasn't worked on something, but they why should they? They sell guns that have their warranty voided on day 1, then sell more. Even the JM930 doesn't go as far as it could. I know you're watching Chuck, pop down to road and have a chat mate

[Blackstuff]

You can get pumps where the lifter stays up for loading (Supernova for one), but i've never seen a semi with that feature. Probably something to do with the speed/timing of the guns cycle. Would definitely be a handy feature though.

Have to say though my M2, and every M2 i've seen has been reliable to a fault in its factory configuration. Its only when people start tinkering and don't do the job properly i've seen reliability suffer. I'm guilty of that myself, when i fiited a CRUMS lifter to avoid 'Benelli Bite' i didn't turn the lip down properly and that caused jams. Fixed in less than 10 mins though once i knew what the problem was.

[Demonic69]

When I did the UKPSA safety course there were 3 M2s with faults, one brand new! At my local club there's barely been a month without an M2 playing silly buggers. Saying that it's probably just a tiny percentage, there are just more out there.