FAC timescales for Thames Valley?

[Christel]

There is absolutely no way an FEO should arrive unannounced unless he is tagging along with CO/SO19's or whatever they are's finest... FEO's are usually good sorts and well worth establishing a relationship with, my FEO is typical in that he is straight as a die and always keen to make sure everything is spot on and I have heard him described as everything from a legend to a top chap, never a bad word about him.

Welcome to the forum and good luck with the FAC, no idea re TV so hopefully it will be processed in a timely manner.

Well that's interesting. I wonder if the instructor at Bisley who mentioned this was just trying to wind us up. So there is no truth that they perform random, unannounced inspections? Unannounced would be a good way of ensuring that you are correctly following safety procedures and not leaving things lying around.

I would ask the instructor at Bisley where he got that from.

1: They do not have time to do that.
2: Pretty sure somewhere in the law it states that they have to make an appointment unless it is a raid, please correct me if wrong.
3: Make sure your wife/partner if home alone do not let anybody in even with being showed ID and under no circumstances does she/he know where the keys are, tell her/him to ask them to make an appointment when you are home.
4: Know your rights, don't let anyone bully you.
5: Establish a good relationship with your FEO, that can save a lot of situations.
6: In many cases the FEO will help you if the licensing department behaves awkwardly.

[dromia]

Durham have been telling individual FAC holders to expect unannounced visits.

[G_C]

There is absolutely no way an FEO should arrive unannounced unless he is tagging along with CO/SO19's or whatever they are's finest... FEO's are usually good sorts and well worth establishing a relationship with, my FEO is typical in that he is straight as a die and always keen to make sure everything is spot on and I have heard him described as everything from a legend to a top chap, never a bad word about him.

Welcome to the forum and good luck with the FAC, no idea re TV so hopefully it will be processed in a timely manner.

Well that's interesting. I wonder if the instructor at Bisley who mentioned this was just trying to wind us up. So there is no truth that they perform random, unannounced inspections? Unannounced would be a good way of ensuring that you are correctly following safety procedures and not leaving things lying around.

I would ask the instructor at Bisley where he got that from.

1: They do not have time to do that.
2: Pretty sure somewhere in the law it states that they have to make an appointment unless it is a raid, please correct me if wrong.
3: Make sure your wife/partner if home alone do not let anybody in even with being showed ID and under no circumstances does she/he know where the keys are, tell her/him to ask them to make an appointment when you are home.
4: Know your rights, don't let anyone bully you.
5: Establish a good relationship with your FEO, that can save a lot of situations.
6: In many cases the FEO will help you if the licensing department behaves awkwardly.

Thanks, good points. My wife will also be applying for an FAC, we plan to mirror them so that we can share a single gun safe. With just the two of us in the house anytime anyone is at home will mean that location of keys will be known.

[G_C]

One other question regarding the six month wait. After you submit the application do you get any feedback on its progress or is it complete silence until you hear about a date for your interview?

[JSC]

I'm in TV and last year my renewal took 10 months or so and I had to chase it to get it done by then. A simple variation recently took 10 weeks and needed chasing to get it done in that time.

The pattern in my area is usually:
1. Send in paperwork and any payment
2. Hear nothing
3. Call FEO to try and get my paperwork moved to the 'top of the pile'
4. If successful with (3), wait for licensing department to print new certificate and hope they haven't made any mistakes with it (not uncommon)

There's rarely proactive feedback from FEO or HQ as to how an application is going. I wouldn't be surprised if you don't hear anything for 6 months and then need to chase it up to find out where you are in the process.

Last year, there was supposedly a water leak which caused additional delays in processing applications. They may still be clearing a backlog for all we know, but certainly their current published estimate of 60 days for a grant, renewal or variation is just not accurate based on my own experiences and what I've heard from others. This has led to them having to issue S7 temporary certificates in a lot of cases, including mine, but the question has to be asked if they can find the time to do that why can't they process the actual certificate?

In any case, I have found that the bottle neck appears to lie mainly with the FEOs. They have had some territorial shuffling around to put up with and there are less of them covering bigger areas now, so I can't see the delays becoming less anytime soon. The only thing you can really do is give them a call every now and then to see how your application is going and try and get it moved up the pile.

As for unannounced visits, I haven't heard of any taking place and I doubt they have time to do it unless they have some intelligence on someone doing something wrong. You are not obliged to let them in if they do turn up unannounced and I would suggest that until they can meet their published timescales for processing applications they would be better off concentrating on that aspect of the job rather than wild goose chases.

I'd also echo the above comments about building a good relationship with your FEO, but at the same time be prepared to challenge them if they come out with any suspect 'new rules'. There seems to be more and more instances of FEOs around the country coming out with requirements and restrictions which simply do not exist other than in their own mind.

We must ensure the law is applied fairly and correctly and stand up for our rights as certificate holders.

[G_C]

Thanks JSC, that's very helpful.

[Dark Skies]

RE: Unannounced visits:
http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/news/exclus ... egin-40860

These days you're hard pressed to be permitted to report a crime in a police station (unless it's urgent) - you're expected to phone 101 and hold on until you get bored and do the 'right thing' and give up (keeps the stats down).
Add to that the extreme time it takes to handle even the most basic variation. renewal, or grant of a FAC and I'd be surprised if the police could be bothered to turn up announced on anything other than intelligence led information.

It just wouldn't be a practical use of their resources. How often would they turn up on the off chance only to find the person they want to see is at work / on holiday / down the pub / in bed with the missus / out shopping etc. before they concluded they were wasting their own police time?
It's just a variation on 'Big Brother Is Watching You' to keep FAC holders on their toes.
This is the UK, after all; I've no doubt they'd love to track everyone 24/7 but the reality is Britain is the home of the under-funded cock-up and the model for Terry Gilliam's film Brazil.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvBF3Lxla98

[Rockhopper]

Unannounced Home Visits
19.11. Where it is judged necessary, based on specific intelligence in light of a particular threat,
or risk of harm, the police should undertake an unannounced home visit to check the
security of a certificate holder’s firearms and shotguns. It is not expected that the police will
undertake an unannounced home visit at an unsocial hour unless there is a justified and
specific requirement to do so on the grounds of crime prevention or public safety concerns
and the police judge that this action is both justified and proportionate.
19.12 Paragraph 23.3 of this guidance sets out the power of entry, subject to warrant, available
to the police. While this is an important power, it should not be necessary to use in all
cases where inspections/home visits are required as such enquiries or inspections may be
carried out with the certificate holder’s consent. It is expected that responsible certificate
holders will co-operate with reasonable requests to inspect security arrangements or other
aspects of suitability, and failure to do so may be taken into account when police consider
suitability to possess the firearms. To mitigate any misunderstanding on the part of the
certificate holder the police must provide a clear and reasoned explanation to the certificate
holder at the time of the visit.

[GeeRam]

http://www.full-bore.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=28708

Shame I don't live in Wiltshire! I see that the county by county performance talks about renewal timescales. I don't recall where I read it but I thought I read that initial applications (as mine will be) were quicker than renewals. Any truth in that or am I definitely in for a 6 month wait?

This link gives grant timescales........you need go to the bottom of the list to find TVP, which states 180 days for a grant, so circa 6 months. But, as said by others from experience, 6 months is really quite an optimistic figure for a grant from TVP.

http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/firearms/fi ... aled-82854

Have you (and the wife) actually posted off the completed forms yet, or are you still awaiting the go-ahead from your club?

[G_C]

http://www.full-bore.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=28708

Shame I don't live in Wiltshire! I see that the county by county performance talks about renewal timescales. I don't recall where I read it but I thought I read that initial applications (as mine will be) were quicker than renewals. Any truth in that or am I definitely in for a 6 month wait?

This link gives grant timescales........you need go to the bottom of the list to find TVP, which states 180 days for a grant, so circa 6 months. But, as said by others from experience, 6 months is really quite an optimistic figure for a grant from TVP.

http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/firearms/fi ... aled-82854

Have you (and the wife) actually posted off the completed forms yet, or are you still awaiting the go-ahead from your club?

We haven't sent off the forms yet. We're currently probationary members of the NRA and will be shooting at Bisley. I believe you need to be a member of a club for a minimum of three months. If this time starts from initial probationary membership (11th Jan for us), not from when you receive the safe shooter certificate then given a six month delay I guess we could send them off now.