Additional restriction on ammunition

[Dellboy]

I had a 308 rifle and a 6.5cm barrel on my RFD register and an open slot on my own ticket hadny swapped it over as i used it as a demo rifle for the bussiness , Gets a call after my licence was renewed asking to send it back to take these off as i hadnt filled them . I explained the situation but they wouldnt have it so i put the phone on speaker took the rifle etc out of one cabinet and put it in another then sent the aquired and sold paperwork off . This is an area that was running well behind on times for renewal etc

[Mattnall]

Blah blah, "in accordance with home office guidance"

Ask them to quote what section of the guidance it came from to you. Then ask them to read the rest of the paragraph (it'll be Para 12.54 if it is a target shooting condition) and consider the quantities in accordance with the information therein.

You don't mention what the quantities are now. That would have an impact on the argument.

[Mattnall]

BUT I can't find a figure quoted in the HO Guidance to support this

What is the condition of use? If it is pest control the numbers are mentioned in para12.24, Fox is Para12.25, Deer is 12.30, targets shooting is 12.54.

Each mention of a quantity comes with a caveat similar to "but account should be taken of individual circumstances". So if you/your friend has an issue and thinks they have a genuine reason for a higher limit then go ahead and put your case to the FEO.

I have several thousand on both 22 and 223 as I shoot a lot. It comes up at each renewal but has stayed the same as that is seen as a reasonable quantity for the amount I shoot and the type of shooting I do. I am also in BCH.

[Daryll]

I've just had a 1-4-1 variation and the FEO rang and said that my existing ammo allocations were over the 300 limit in the guidelines. After a bit of discussion I asked to keep the 2k .22rf, and 750 for .38/357, but everything else could go down to 300.
When my FAC arrived the allocations were unchanged, but they'd only given me 300 for the new calibre.
Thinking about it, on the variation form it doesn't ask (or I can't remember seeing) a column for how many rnds of a calibre you want... it used to on a the paper forms..

The online system we have in Herts doesn't have a 'number of rounds' for the 1 for 1 variation as you'd already have an allocation for that. Standard variation for new firearm and ammo does have it. 300 seems to be the norm.... BUT I can't find a figure quoted in the HO Guidance to support this

In Cambs we probably use the same system as Herts.. and same people..
But I got rid of a S1 12 gauge but not Slug, and replaced it with a 6.5x55, so how would I "already have an allocation for that" ??
I'm guessing that someone has taken the figure of 300 and made that the arbitary figure for ammo allocations on new additions to an FAC.

[Alpha1]

I've just had a 1-4-1 variation and the FEO rang and said that my existing ammo allocations were over the 300 limit in the guidelines. After a bit of discussion I asked to keep the 2k .22rf, and 750 for .38/357, but everything else could go down to 300.
When my FAC arrived the allocations were unchanged, but they'd only given me 300 for the new calibre.
Thinking about it, on the variation form it doesn't ask (or I can't remember seeing) a column for how many rnds of a calibre you want... it used to on a the paper forms..

The online system we have in Herts doesn't have a 'number of rounds' for the 1 for 1 variation as you'd already have an allocation for that. Standard variation for new firearm and ammo does have it. 300 seems to be the norm.... BUT I can't find a figure quoted in the HO Guidance to support this

In Cambs we probably use the same system as Herts.. and same people..
But I got rid of a S1 12 gauge but not Slug, and replaced it with a 6.5x55, so how would I "already have an allocation for that" ??
I'm guessing that someone has taken the figure of 300 and made that the arbitrary figure for ammo allocations on new additions to an FAC.

They may be using 300 as an arbitrary figure but the point is they should not and need to be challenged.

[Mattnall]

...
I'm guessing that someone has taken the figure of 300 and made that the arbitrary figure for ammo allocations on new additions to an FAC.

300 used to be the guide starting figure for pest control in the Guidance IIRC, but even then the next part of the Guidance mentioned that this figure should not be considered maximum and larger amounts may be authorised according to the individual circumstances. Now thge Guidance seems to mention 250 rounds in these instances, but still says that larger amounts may be authorised.

... but the point is they ... need to be challenged.

This is the crux of it, let them get away with it and it becomes the norm.
The OP doesn't mention what use the rifles are for and so the 300 figure may well be a suitable amount. If there is no movement from the FEO then every few months send in a request for a new Table 2 page of the FAC and eventually they will see that a higher amount may be more suitable.
I'm in Herts (actually Cambs, Beds and Herts, it is the same office in Cambs that deals with it all) and have found them to be very reasonable and there may be more details to this than given here.

The taking of a spare slot without consultation is more concerning to me, it is wrong without first speaking to the FAC holder and actually against the HO Guidance. It should be challenged and be brought up with them soonest, or accept it and lose the slot. Paragraph 10.14 of the HO Guidance refers and says the Chief Officer may regard an unfilled slot as reason to enquire why it is unfilled and then make a decision whether to allow the slot to remain based upon the answer.

[Mike95]

12 months to renew my club FAC .. when I got it, all the variations were removed and most of the ammunition.. seems to be a regular item ..

Mike95

[PeterN]

The last time I renewed the club FAC about three years ago it turned up in the post about seven weeks early, no visit, no contact, nothing. I did apply in good time. I was happy with that.
Why are there ammunition limits anyway? Most people will only have what they need, be it 60 rounds a year or 2000 rounds a month. If someone is going to stockpile for a non legal purpose, they will do it anyway. There are no limits on shotgun ammunition and that does not cause a problem. No limits on rifle ammunition would not cause a problem also.
Regards
Peter.

[Graham M]

But you are talking common sense. Since when did common sense apply to firearms licencing.

[Blackstuff]

A non-voluntary ammo limit reduction is quite a serious thing and shouldn't be accepted with a shrug of the shoulders. I'd want it in writing with clear reasoning provided and then i'd be speaking with the legal team of my shooting organisation.