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.22 ARs fall simply into two groups. Smith & Wesson and everything else.

If you want an ultra reliable, accurate, fully functioning, customisable, “best magazine” available, then get a Smith.

If you don’t “like” polymer, buy something else. In this bracket price is your guide. They may “feel” better but they are unlikely to perform better.

Umarex will never equal the M&P.

Moved to correct forum, be aware in future misposts will be removed.

Sim G wrote:.22 ARs fall simply into two groups. Smith & Wesson and everything else.

If you want an ultra reliable, accurate, fully functioning, customisable, “best magazine” available, then get a Smith.

If you don’t “like” polymer, buy something else. In this bracket price is your guide. They may “feel” better but they are unlikely to perform better.

Umarex will never equal the M&P.

This /\ /\ /\

I've never understood people wanting a heavy rifle When a gun has as little recoil as a .22lr i'd like it to weigh absolutely nothing, it means its faster to bring on target, faster to point, slow down and less tiring to carry all day. We can't have full-bore semi-auto AR's so its not like having a full metal .22 AR adds anything training/practice-wise

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As a counter, why is *absolute* performance the only thing that seems to matter in the pretendy AR field, and derision and ridicule accompany any choice other than x?

It doesn’t happen anywhere else. If someone chooses a Howa, Remington or Savage in 308 for their first rifle you don’t get people commenting “That’s a bag of nails, only suitable for bashing into the ground. You need an XYZ3000 instead”.

If someone chooses a SMLE or Mosin or any other historic rifle, no one pipes up with “Yeah, don’t know why you bother, it’s a fact that the Tintwhistle-Farquhar model of 43 was .5 MOA better and 3 seconds quicker to load”

They are fun guns; people want different things. Not everyone wants an array of go-faster bits or 200g lighter rifle. I have a Walther/Umarex MP5 as it’s a fun gun and I love how it looks, feels, operates and shoots. That’s all.

All guns are good :)

I’ve got an mp5 too, it’s awesome. Not a very accurate rifle but very dependable. Bold quality is ok, materials are poor.

I’ve got a Cmmg AR which is incredible reliable, accurate and well built, it cost me triple the price of the walther. It too takes Smith mags.

Yes all guns are fun, but it’s worth pointing out the differences between them to people wanting to know more about the market.

Blackstuff wrote:

Sim G wrote:.22 ARs fall simply into two groups. Smith & Wesson and everything else.

If you want an ultra reliable, accurate, fully functioning, customisable, “best magazine” available, then get a Smith.

If you don’t “like” polymer, buy something else. In this bracket price is your guide. They may “feel” better but they are unlikely to perform better.

Umarex will never equal the M&P.

This /\ /\ /\

I've never understood people wanting a heavy rifle When a gun has as little recoil as a .22lr i'd like it to weigh absolutely nothing, it means its faster to bring on target, faster to point, slow down and less tiring to carry all day. We can't have full-bore semi-auto AR's so its not like having a full metal .22 AR adds anything training/practice-wise

Unless your primary dicipline is CSR.

Kungfugerbil wrote:/\

As a counter, why is *absolute* performance the only thing that seems to matter in the pretendy AR field, and derision and ridicule accompany any choice other than x?

It doesn’t happen anywhere else. If someone chooses a Howa, Remington or Savage in 308 for their first rifle you don’t get people commenting “That’s a bag of nails, only suitable for bashing into the ground. You need an XYZ3000 instead”.

It may very well be that in the pretendy AR field, a rifle that doesn’t work is actually pointless. Semi rim fires are a whole different kettle of fish compared to either milsurp or modern, full bore bolt guns.

Airbrush wrote:

Blackstuff wrote:
This /\ /\ /\

I've never understood people wanting a heavy rifle When a gun has as little recoil as a .22lr i'd like it to weigh absolutely nothing, it means its faster to bring on target, faster to point, slow down and less tiring to carry all day. We can't have full-bore semi-auto AR's so its not like having a full metal .22 AR adds anything training/practice-wise

Unless your primary dicipline is CSR.

How though? Other than building up muscle, which surely would be more effectively achieved in a gym? None of the CSR i've seen is shot in the same way as you would typically use a .22 in for mini-rifle i.e. short duration, explosive stages. Wouldn't it be better for CSR to strive to make the rifle for that as light as possible, rather than go the other way?


I have a bare Walther* MP5 and its slightly heavier than my 15-22 with every imaginable accessory clagged on it including a red-dot and magnifier!

*Umarex is the US importer and the owner of Walther but they don't make them

Sim G wrote:It may very well be that in the pretendy AR field, a rifle that doesn’t work is actually pointless.

Why would it not work? Many people have ‘Non-Smith&Wesson’s that work perfectly well for the use required of them. My MP5 facsimile has never - never - had a FTF or FTE in the time I’ve shot it and can comfortably put every single shot in minute-of-palm-of-hand at the range. That is working just fine.

Different folks, different strokes. It just only seems to be the M&P that evokes this “I’ve got x so y is junk” response. Odd.