The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

In another thread (http://www.full-bore.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=9434) andrewh pointed out that Cardiff Uni had recruited 60 students to their shooting club, but were having to instruct them across 5 firing points.

Doing the maths, that implies that people are only going to get a few minutes shooting time (so, maybe 120 minutes / 12 = 10 minutes, once or twice a week). Term time is only 10 weeks, and it makes me wonder whether some people might drop out because either:

• they don't get enough shooting time to see whether it's really for them (and there is much more hanging around time)
• there is comparatively little variety in what they get to shoot - so although smallbore might not be for you, by the time that a full bore shoot comes around (especially given that at this time of year there might not be that many), you've lost interest.

At the same time, shooting could do with an influx of new (and younger) blood. So, I wondered how feasible it would be to offer some sort of mentoring scheme by willing members of the forum? Scaling the Cardiff experience up to all 25 University shooting clubs, there are potentially 60 x 25 willing young shooters. At the end of this term, they'll disperse around the country as they go home for 4 weeks. Many probably have little idea of where their local shooting clubs are or how they could use them. But if some of the forum members were willing to take them under their wing, as it were, it might give the students the opportunity to attend a club local to their home. No doubt it would also give them the opportunity to shoot something a little bit different, a little bit more interesting, and spend a longer time doing it.

I haven't talked to the organisers at my club yet, but I know for a fact that the age profile is moving ever upward, and they would love some new blood.

Is it a stupid idea? Any pitfalls...?

Earlier in the year while our club was at Bisley, Short Siberia, we saw a group wearing Cardiff University Rifle Club shirts. One young lady took interest in what bnz was shooting, Steyr CISM and asked questions. She grinned when bnz offered for her to have a go. She did pretty well with it and mentioned how little recoil it had. She had only ever fired .22 with the club and was looking to move up but was limited to whatever the club did. The lads looked a little envious but as she took the initiative to ask questions she gained useful experience. Hopefully it gave her the incentive to move on as well.
We often see uni teams, is there any reason why we can’t let them have a go one on one if appropriate?

Apphelia wrote:In another thread (http://www.full-bore.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=9434) andrewh pointed out that Cardiff Uni had recruited 60 students to their shooting club, but were having to instruct them across 5 firing points.

Doing the maths, that implies that people are only going to get a few minutes shooting time (so, maybe 120 minutes / 12 = 10 minutes, once or twice a week). Term time is only 10 weeks, and it makes me wonder whether some people might drop out because either:

• they don't get enough shooting time to see whether it's really for them (and there is much more hanging around time)
• there is comparatively little variety in what they get to shoot - so although smallbore might not be for you, by the time that a full bore shoot comes around (especially given that at this time of year there might not be that many), you've lost interest.

At the same time, shooting could do with an influx of new (and younger) blood. So, I wondered how feasible it would be to offer some sort of mentoring scheme by willing members of the forum? Scaling the Cardiff experience up to all 25 University shooting clubs, there are potentially 60 x 25 willing young shooters. At the end of this term, they'll disperse around the country as they go home for 4 weeks. Many probably have little idea of where their local shooting clubs are or how they could use them. But if some of the forum members were willing to take them under their wing, as it were, it might give the students the opportunity to attend a club local to their home. No doubt it would also give them the opportunity to shoot something a little bit different, a little bit more interesting, and spend a longer time doing it.

I haven't talked to the organisers at my club yet, but I know for a fact that the age profile is moving ever upward, and they would love some new blood.

Is it a stupid idea? Any pitfalls...?

OK, of the 60+ members of Cardiff Uni club about 10% never turn up, this is usually because they have joined far too many different sports clubs, and 20% are those left from last year. This leaves about 45 new members, of who about 5 have done some target shooting before (this year 2 have done a fair bit of target shooting) and another 5-10 have done some form of shooting before. The old members (soon joined by those who already knew what they were doing) tend to shoot at a different time from the rest who have to fit into two sessions of up to four hours each. This gives up to forty firing point hours (for 5 points) divided between 40+ people. So about an hour per person per week. This seems like a lot, but it seems to take forever between each detail to get everyone set up with whatever kit they are going to use. Since University sports clubs get support because they take part in the various inter university competitions (BUCS) that is the main style of shooting followed (mainly prone 22, first at 25 yds, then they venture to 50m & 100 yards).

bobbob wrote:Earlier in the year while our club was at Bisley, Short Siberia, we saw a group wearing Cardiff University Rifle Club shirts.
We often see uni teams, is there any reason why we can’t let them have a go one on one if appropriate?

As long as they are:

A club

Home Office Approved

Functioning as both the above

you can lend/hire/sell them any S1 firearm and ammo to have a go with. S15 Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988 is the relevant bit of legislation. Oh, and if they are doing it at Bisley they have to be NRA affiliated, have demonstrated insurance to the NRA or you have to have declared it as a Guest Day or other mechanism to bring them within your insurance.

Iain

andrewh wrote:Since University sports clubs get support because they take part in the various inter university competitions (BUCS) that is the main style of shooting followed (mainly prone 22, first at 25 yds, then they venture to 50m & 100 yards).

Herein lies the problem for university clubs: funding. Cash injections from student unions are usually conditional on competing in the British Universities and Colleges Sport leagues, and those leagues only run for smallbore. This means uni clubs generally know very little about all the other disciplines, such as SR, gallery rifle, practical rifle, etc etc. There's a universities shotgun competition but I can't remember much about it from my uni days.

The real problem is the experience base within university clubs. That's where linking with local clubs can be a benefit... although, even within shooters, there's a generational gap which takes a fair bit of bridging. No matter how well intentioned the local club might be, if they're all of one age group and the university club are of that age group, you're going to have problems convincing the students to hang around.

Gaz wrote:

andrewh wrote:Since University sports clubs get support because they take part in the various inter university competitions (BUCS) that is the main style of shooting followed (mainly prone 22, first at 25 yds, then they venture to 50m & 100 yards).

Herein lies the problem for university clubs: funding. Cash injections from student unions are usually conditional on competing in the British Universities and Colleges Sport leagues, and those leagues only run for smallbore. This means uni clubs generally know very little about all the other disciplines, such as SR, gallery rifle, practical rifle, etc etc. There's a universities shotgun competition but I can't remember much about it from my uni days.

The real problem is the experience base within university clubs. That's where linking with local clubs can be a benefit... although, even within shooters, there's a generational gap which takes a fair bit of bridging. No matter how well intentioned the local club might be, if they're all of one age group and the university club are of that age group, you're going to have problems convincing the students to hang around.

There are TR competitions as well, although these are not leagues but championships (during the NRA meeting).

bobbob wrote:...We often see uni teams, is there any reason why we can’t let them have a go one on one if appropriate?

Hi bobbob. What I was proposing was to be a bit more proactive. This forum has around 700 members. I was hoping that if enough people were interested that it might be possible to approach the Uni clubs and make the offer to give interested students the opportunity for a bit of shooting close to home during their vacations. As a herd they tend to stick together, but for the more adventurous ones I can see that it might be appealing (and it could then snowball).

andrewh wrote:OK, of the 60+ members of Cardiff Uni club about 10% never turn up, this is usually because they have joined far too many different sports clubs, and 20% are those left from last year. This leaves about 45 new members, of who about 5 have done some target shooting before (this year 2 have done a fair bit of target shooting) and another 5-10 have done some form of shooting before. The old members (soon joined by those who already knew what they were doing) tend to shoot at a different time from the rest who have to fit into two sessions of up to four hours each. This gives up to forty firing point hours (for 5 points) divided between 40+ people. So about an hour per person per week. This seems like a lot, but it seems to take forever between each detail to get everyone set up with whatever kit they are going to use. Since University sports clubs get support because they take part in the various inter university competitions (BUCS) that is the main style of shooting followed (mainly prone 22, first at 25 yds, then they venture to 50m & 100 yards).

Thanks, Andrew, for giving us some concrete figures and insights from personal experience (rather than just my not very good estimate). It's interesting from your figures that only about 20% are existing members - that's quite a drop off (even accounting for people graduating and third year panic).

I appreciate that a lot of the Uni teams are interested in competition, although quite a few also seem to run "fun" shoots. I'm still of the inclination, however, that as shooters we could do more to encourage people into enjoying the activity, and that experience at a local club would give them opportunities to have a go at disciplines that they otherwise wouldn't encounter (as you have pointed out).

Gaz wrote:The real problem is the experience base within university clubs. That's where linking with local clubs can be a benefit... although, even within shooters, there's a generational gap which takes a fair bit of bridging. No matter how well intentioned the local club might be, if they're all of one age group and the university club are of that age group, you're going to have problems convincing the students to hang around.

I see what you are saying about linking Uni clubs with local clubs, but I was meaning giving the opportunity for individual students to experience clubs local to their home (really in vacation time). If (as a member) I turn up with one of my son's friends in tow, other club members are more than willing to let him or her have a go with whatever they are shooting. On their own I doubt that the youngsters would have had the confidence to approach any of the "old farts" to ask if they could have a go.

What I have also seen is that where there is a younger or more inexperienced member on their own, established members tend to gravitate to them and ask them about their interests. I do agree though that when you get the influx of a group they tend not to integrate as well (especially if, like students, there are protracted periods when they just don't show up).

Apphelia wrote:It's interesting from your figures that only about 20% are existing members - that's quite a drop off (even accounting for people graduating and third year panic).

Good years and less good years. At this point last year there were about 45 members, and at least two of the new members were on one year Masters courses. Also some that may yet return know that the first few weeks are a bit zoo like, so don't sign up for a while (tends to be those who only turn up a couple of time each term anyway).

Cardiff use the local club's range, and get a fair bit of support from various members of the other clubs that use the same range. Some of the students also join the local clubs if they want to do more competition. There is the odd student that is around a long time, when I was an undergrad in London it was always medics, that help with continuity, now it seems to be engineers (four or five year course plus a year or more in industry in some cases)