WWT call from total lead ban

[gunsmoke]

The wwt have total for a total lead ban using the work of the BASC and WWT on compliance with the lead ban.

[youtube]http://youtu.be/LDwv7rGj_ko[/youtube]

[M99]

The wwt have total for a total lead ban using the work of the BASC and WWT on compliance with the lead ban.

[youtube]http://youtu.be/LDwv7rGj_ko[/youtube]

Gunsmoke.

You are going to try and stir up the same anti BASC debate here you tried on PW - yet you chose to ignore the direct answers BASC gave you in the thread - Try reading David's answers and you will see what BASC have actually secured from the 3 major parties - or just read it on the BASC website.

[Dougan]

I don't think it would do the image of wildfoulers (and shooters in general) any harm to go to non-toxic - It can't be denied that smaller shot does get picked up like grit, and that it's bad for the birds...even though it does look like a lot of the lead in migratory birds doesn't actually get picked up here....

Genuine question (I really don't know) - How much is 100 normal cartridges, and how much is 100 non-toxic?

[M99]

I don't think it would do the image of wildfoulers (and shooters in general) any harm to go to non-toxic - It can't be denied that smaller shot does get picked up like grit, and that it's bad for the birds...even though it does look like a lot of the lead in migratory birds doesn't actually get picked up here....

Genuine question (I really don't know) - How much is 100 normal cartridges, and how much is 100 non-toxic?

Dougan,

Lead has been banned for shooting wildfowl for over 10 years! - the WWT survey figures show that 10% of those tested between 1971 and 2010 had ingested lead - now that is over 30 years and 10% - so not as bad as people are trying to make out.

There is no direct link that the lead was from either shot or fishing weights (Also banned for over 10 years!!) - there is an awful lot of lead out there from things like paint, lead pipes etc.

[Primer]

I don't think it would do the image of wildfoulers (and shooters in general) any harm to go to non-toxic - It can't be denied that smaller shot does get picked up like grit, and that it's bad for the birds...even though it does look like a lot of the lead in migratory birds doesn't actually get picked up here....

Genuine question (I really don't know) - How much is 100 normal cartridges, and how much is 100 non-toxic?

Looking at just cartridges website for game loads from around £20-28 per 100 lead, steel is from £100 and bismuth/hevishot £200

I pay about £16 per hundred for 28g 7.5 shot for clays, we can't use steel at the shooting ground due to ricochets.

[rufrdr]

Lead bullets are outlawed for hunting in California within the range of the condors as the regulators say that the stupid birds are eating spent bullets and dying from lead poisoning. Other studies say that they are dying from drinking spilled antifreeze from parking lots. It seems to be a reason to ban lead bullets and make hunting so expensive that most give up on it. They are trying to spread the lead ban to Arizona next.

Migratory waterfowl in the U.S. must be hunted with non-toxic (steel or bismuth)shot.

On a somewhat related topic, after being a shooter and reloader since 1971 I had my blood tested for lead at my recent annual physical. The doc didn't bat an eye when I told him why I wanted it. On a scale of 0-10 I was less than 2. Maybe if it was zero I would be a PhD now but oh well. For what it's worth.

[Dougan]

I don't think it would do the image of wildfoulers (and shooters in general) any harm to go to non-toxic - It can't be denied that smaller shot does get picked up like grit, and that it's bad for the birds...even though it does look like a lot of the lead in migratory birds doesn't actually get picked up here....

Genuine question (I really don't know) - How much is 100 normal cartridges, and how much is 100 non-toxic?

Dougan,

Lead has been banned for shooting wildfowl for over 10 years! - the WWT survey figures show that 10% of those tested between 1971 and 2010 had ingested lead - now that is over 30 years and 10% - so not as bad as people are trying to make out.

There is no direct link that the lead was from either shot or fishing weights (Also banned for over 10 years!!) - there is an awful lot of lead out there from things like paint, lead pipes etc.

I don't think there'd be any difficulty telling the difference between shooting and fishing shot from an autopsy (though X-ray may be difficult), as small fishing shot has a split in it - Also, being an angler, I know that since the ban you could not buy anything but non-toxic fishing shot...where as it wouldn't surprise me if many wildfoulers still use lead when they can get away with it (though I can't substantiate that), due to cost (thanks for the info Primer ).

But I agree with what you're saying about it not being as bad as it's being made out...not nationally anyway - I would imagine that it is more localised, and if tests were done properly, some real links to specific places could be made...though even non-migratory birds move around....

....plus like all these contentious environmental arguments, both sides will bend the statistics to suit themselves.

One thing that would obviously help, would be to get the cost of non-toxic shot down...

[zeroveez]

A couple of years ago I attended a deer stalking regional meeting, (BASC), at which about seventy members met to hear a talk on lead in meat and game given by a vet. He cited research carried out in America on blood lead levels in people from Michigan, a renowned huntin, fishin and shootin State. Verily and lo, blood lead levels were higher in people that ate venison and game. However, one of the findings that the study did not report was that the blood level of the average New Yorker was higher than any in Michigan. Another interesting finding was that baseline measurements of blood lead were taken from some Amazon Indians, supposedly because they had no exposure to shooting, the motor car or even household paint. Amazingly enough the Indians' blood lead was the highest of all coming from the lead glaze in their cooking pots. One fact was established, though, namely that established pheasant drives here in the uk had serious amounts of contamination.

[Chuck]

Any attempt at banning lead is just an attack on HUNTING or fishing......there is enough crap floating around as it is......trying to ban LEAD is just a way of banning hunting.

Sooner or later "NON TOXIC" will be responsible for something...banned..... and then what??


The Commiefornians want to ban everything and anything...weirdo state for sure...