Which .308 T/R foresight?

[Jabberwocky413]

Following on from an successful earlier thread of mine which resulted in me buying my first T/R I now need advice on replacing the foresight. I have scanned through the interweb and found two likely candidates and would appreciate any ones thoughts,experiences or reviews? They are:

The RPA trakker 22mm http://www.rangemasterprecisionarms.com ... pa-sights/

and the HPS 32mm http://www.hps-tr.com/products/sights/


Or are there any others?
What are the advantages of an Iris over element inserts for example?
The rifle is a Paramount 7.62/.308 30 in 1 in 13 twist with a Paramount rear sight fitted, to be used mainly at Bisley 200, 300 and 600m with the odd go on Thistledown 900/1000m.
Thanks in advance folks.

[johngarnett]

Check out the RightSight made by Wayne Forshee (US) of Stallings Machine Co. Also check for lenses, filters etc on Art Neergard's US site, Shooting Sight. (Art is a UK FBer too.) Top quality stuff.

JohnG :cornwall:

[Dougan]

I can't really advise you on this as I've only used the basic Fultons one (which does the job OK) - but I have noticed that the more experienced and successful TR shooters seem to use the larger 32mm front sights.....I'd be interested in some others comments on this..

Personally I like the iris over elements, as you can tweak it easily on the firing point without too much disruption.

Be aware though mate that if you do go for a large all singing and dancing one, there will be a certain amount of ribbing...later followed by a few of us upgrading razz

[johngarnett]

I should have read your question a bit more thoroughly!!

The 30/32mm sights give more light through the foresight tube. I find that this defines my target/aperture picture. You can also see the target number boards with less disturbance making for a better sight picture.

A variable iris is better because it saves having separate elements to fiddle with between ranges. Sods Law dictates you will drop the one you want in the longest area of grass minutes before Message 1! They always fall forward of the line so you have to close down the detail to pick up one flimsy element!

You can alter the foresight height to take out the large jumps in elevation to save change of head position on the stock when making all elevation changes on the rear sight only.

Other makes : Riles, Rightsight, HPS and one made in Australia (don't think it varies in height). Intershoot supply Rightsights. There is a mass of info online in the 'Rifleman's Journal' by German Salazar(?) You need to check your barrel diameter for the barrel band but it can be turned down or the band opened up!

One comment I have heard is that there is more area to catch the wind on a 30mm'er. It is a fact, but I've never had a problem. The biggest problem is that you will have an excellent set up and less excuses for c**p shooting!!

Hope this helps

JohnG :cornwall:

[IainWR]

Also remember that if you fit a lens in the foresight, there are limits on the lens you are allowed to put in the rearsight under TR competition rules (NRA rule 150 and others).

[rox]

I now need advice on replacing the foresight.

One of the most popular larger diameter foresights amongst TR shooters is the Riles model. There is a UK agent who usually holds good stock of all the components and accessories, and as a Surrey based shooter you might be able to try out various combinations of them as the importer is Bisley based. One fitting on the barrel will accommodate 18, 22 and 30 mm tubes. I bought a 30mm tube with 0.5 lens, and another with a 0.3 lens, then an 18mm tube to hold my existing iris, lens and tubes.

The RPA used to be popular (when they were almost alone in the adjustable-height front-sight market), but they are susceptible to getting bent. The sights where the vertical is part of the tube assembly (and therefore come off when you remove the tube) are much stronger and more popular these days. The HPS is ok, but was *very* expensive when I looked at it.

One of the drawbacks of larger tubes and lenses is that you will need sun shades and some means of preventing rain from obscuring the lens. Even with rain protectors you can fall victim to fogging of a front lens - something that has dropped me a step on the podium in the past. Using these lenses doesn't necessarily result in a better performance, even if it improves the sight picture. It can depend on your eyes - In general I've had better results with a 0.3 lens than a 0.5. I've also had better results when forced to shoot with no lens at short range in otherwise identical conditions (60 shot 300m match under ISSF rules compared with a 60 shot match the previous day under NRA conditions). There are also those who prefer 22mm tubes; arguments in favour include allegedly better quality lenses, as well as being less susceptible to rain.

..

[Jabberwocky413]

Lots to take onboard there fellas, Ta!
So it looks like a 30mm foresight with an iris is the way forward.
Thanks johngarnet for the manufacturers suggestions i shall have a look at them especially the Riles as its got two mentions in this thread. The Riflemans journal you recommend, is that a blog?
Rox, I too have heard that the RPA sight can bend and your right about the HPS price, the 32mm with all the bells and whistles comes to £438, without fitting!!! Imagine paying that, shooting like a pillock then getting it in the neck from Dougan all day!
The question of lenses I hadn't even thought of and will have to look at in more detail.

[johngarnett]

Jabber,
Lenses : You can get two standard power lenses in most 30mm sights. A 0.25dioptre and a 0.50dioptre. The supplied RightSight is a drop-in lens, 0.50d, held by a rubber ring. Good, but not easy to remove when fogged or for cleaning 'on the line'. I have gone the Shooting Sight screw-in lens mount way with filters and shades. You can buy the basic sight from Wayne and then get Art Neergards lenses and tubes. I'm not sure about Riles, but I guess a similar setup.
I was aged about 50 (65 now) when I got my first foresight lens and that was the 0.25d power. I still use this for all distances but I have a 0.50d ready! I may try this power for 'over the hill' this year as some US shooters do apparently. 0.25 for short, 0.50 for long. Basically if you have 'young eyes', up to age 45/50, then try the 0.25d lens. Older, try the 0.50d. If you do use a lens you may need to consider the larger aperture range iris, so you need to try the big sights, lens choice and iris on someones setup. I use a 4.0 to 6.0 mm iris for both lens powers. You can end up with a very expensive 'spares' box!!

Good researching!!

JohnG :cornwall:

PS all the above relates to a shooter with 'normal' 6/6 vision. If you need spex for distance this has to be taken into consideration. PM me if you need more info on this.

[Gaz]

I have a Fultons foresight with an iris. The iris is a godsend - i used to shoot with elements and they were a pain. I still have them as my fallback option, though. As for lenses ... Better shooters than me use them with great success. However, more than once in wet weather I've seen lenses fog up, complete with anguished howls from the shooters using them! With my old fashioned adjustable hole (steady now) I keep on pottering away.

A large foresight is probably an advantage. I find my 22mm one adequate but I do spend a bit of time hunting for the target at long range. If the light changes it's very noticeable.

[Dougan]

Imagine paying that, shooting like a pillock then getting it in the neck from Dougan all day!

Would I do that to our newest member?

As expected, you got some good advice - Bear in mind the bit about ending up with 'an expensive spares box'...I jumped the gun when I decided to pimp up my front sight with an iris and glare tubes, and bought lenses to try as well...as it turns out I'm long-sighted so don't need them yet, and get a better sight picture without them.

Another thing to consider is that your choice of iris (with respect to it's range of aperture size) may depend on whether you do need lenses or not...

...so it might be best to get the sight put on and use it a few times with normal elements first (also you can try looking down some of the others rifles with lenses in to see if they'll be of any benefit)...then when you know which aperture size you like best, and whether you want lenses or not, you can decide which bits you need to add to the sight...