ball or bullet?

[meles meles]

So, is that 8" shot off sandbags, two handed or one handed? Over the years I've tried various bullet forms and weights but always find it's a job to beat a good ball and BP.

That was fired one pawed, snout haughtily in the air in as fine a duelling stance as we could muster....

[dromia]

I hope that it wasn't the bent arm stance, it may serve the purpose of protecting some of the vital organs but does nothing towards accuracy.

Straight arm is best, especially with that tripple seven stuff as you want the gun as far away from your face as possible when it explodes.

[meles meles]

We're getting scared now, oomans.

The instructions with our tin of 777 say it's okay to use in muzzle loaders with a 15% reduction in charge vis a vis black powder and with care taken not to compress it or use wads and fillers.

Various interweb fora say much the same.

Dromia, who we knows knows a things or two about BP, says otherwise...

We're in a conundrum. We're quite attached to our paws and want to remain so.

For our gun, proofed for 36 gns of BP, we have BP load data from 20 to 36 gns, hence we started using 777 at the very bottom end of that range, compensated for the 15% energy difference, and settles upon a load of 777 of 17 gns. It gets to 25 easy enough and seems as accurate as we are.

[dromia]

I used tripple even when it first came out as I thought it may have some potential, however despite following Hodgdons instructions and caveats religiously I found it gave pressure spikes and velocity variations which was not conducive to good accuracy.

As SimG has stated it is a nitro powder powder modified for muzzle loading use, none of my black powder guns are nitro proved.

I am sure that it does work safely within the narrow confines of its specification but leaves little room for error. Hodgdon would not be selling it if it was totally dangerous but go beyond their specifications and you are on your own.

Tripple seven like most "new" products has been developed for the modern inline MLs which are so popular in the USA. These guns are almost nitro powder driven muzzle loaders as that is what the customer base wants, nitro guns that can be used in the black powder hunting season. They are not quiet there yet but tripple seven brings them damned close.

Fortunately their is a far better propellant available with far more safety, versatility and less cost, black powder. If you really must use fake black powder then pyrodex is far more forgiving and BP like, my only grievenace iwth it is the very hygroscopic nature of its fouling.

Still it is your hands, face, limbs etc. to self harm as you please

[meles meles]

*Scrubs idea of using a bullet*

[1066]

So, is that 8" shot off sandbags, two handed or one handed? Over the years I've tried various bullet forms and weights but always find it's a job to beat a good ball and BP.

That was fired one pawed, snout haughtily in the air in as fine a duelling stance as we could muster....

To be fair, depending on your experience with precision type pistol shooting, an 8" group at 25 yards isn't too bad. That just about keeps them all in the black on the PL7 target. This would give a score of about 80/100 if the group was centred.

The problem is that:

A) The pistol/load is perfect and capable of shooting 1/2" groups at that range and it's you wobbling about.

B) You have perfected your technique and capable of consistently holding in the 10 ring but the pistol/load is only capable of an 8" group.

C) A combination of the two.

I would suggest you sort the load out using a sandbag rest and eliminate the "human" element as much as possible. Ball size, patch thickness and lubrication as well as powder charge/type all play an important in accuracy.

Depending on the design of the breech plug you may find that 17 gns of powder leaves an airspace between the ball and powder, not really recommended.

[meles meles]

Oh we are far from a perfect pistol shot ! It's probably us that is wobblin' like a goblin.

The ball we are using is a relatively easy fit in the barrel, but very, very snug when we patch it - it takes a good shove with the ramrod to start it and then seat it. We push it down until we can feel it hit the powder charge, and we have a mark on our ramrod to double check that. We're using pre-lubricated cloth patches.

[1066]

It sounds as though you're on the right track - I would switch to Pyrodex or better still BP, see how the pistol is shooting with the aid of a rest then you have a starting point.

My .36 LePage can comfortably keep all shots in the 10 ring at 25 yards, unfortunately I can't :) I'm pleased if I can keep them all in the 8 rings now.

The percussion pistol match I used to shoot in the 1980-90's was 13 shots in 30 minutes at 25 yards on the PL7 targets. No sighting shots but the best 10 shots on the card scored. I guess this is still the same but not sure.

[FredB]

The MLAGB matches are still the same. If you want to win one, your best ten out of thirteen needs to be 96+, but note that, in order to prevent larger calibres having an advantage, instead of inward gauging at least 50% of the hole needs to have crossed the line.
Fred

[meles meles]

The things that put us off black powder are:

1. The faff of getting another licence
2. Having to get a plywood box to store the powder in
3. The (allegedly) greater faff of cleaning the gun afterwards