24" and less, a place to discuss all things handgun related, section 7.3. Long barrelled revolvers, long barrelled pistols and section 5. Overseas contributions are more than welcome.
Can we clear up something as this thread seems to have touched on it, but I'm not sure anyone's answered it definitively.
We all (should) know that a pistol classified as Sec 5 in the UK can't be imported and then converted here to Sec.1.
But if a standard handgun such as a Glock 19 or S&W 686 is purchased by a gunsmith in Germany or the U.S. or wherever it's legal to do so and that gunsmith then takes it apart and rebuilds it with an aftermarket 12" barrel and welds a bit of metal on the back to make it 24" long, then engraves his own company name along the side of it and sells it as a "Smithco" LBP or LBP, that can be sold and imported into the UK?
It's happened, so where is the grey area or is it still up to individual forces to decide for themselves if that's within the law?
JSC wrote:Can we clear up something as this thread seems to have touched on it, but I'm not sure anyone's answered it definitively.
We all (should) know that a pistol classified as Sec 5 in the UK can't be imported and then converted here to Sec.1.
But if a standard handgun such as a Glock 19 or S&W 686 is purchased by a gunsmith in Germany or the U.S. or wherever it's legal to do so and that gunsmith then takes it apart and rebuilds it with an aftermarket 12" barrel and welds a bit of metal on the back to make it 24" long, then engraves his own company name along the side of it and sells it as a "Smithco" LBP or LBP, that can be sold and imported into the UK?
It's happened, so where is the grey area or is it still up to individual forces to decide for themselves if that's within the law?
I think you have hit the nail on the Head.
A glock could be purchased through normal channels in the US, smithed to UK LBP regulations and imported as such.
Which is why it doesnt matter if Glock don't sell frames on their own.
As with most things i believe although the guide lines are in place each Force will have their own interpretation of them which is where the system falls down.
Seems black and white to me. I know there are several Merkle LBRs in the UK built from S&W revolvers. Do we know of any forces refusing to allow those on ticket? Over the years I've heard a lot of stories but hard facts are hard to come by, as usual...
It would seem to me that if a Sec.5 gun crosses the border into the UK then from that point it's going to be classed as Sec. 5 for ever, regardless of what's done to it, but if someone in a far away land makes a Sec. 1 gun out of whatever bits and pieces are available to them, then you're buying a Sec.1 gun.
The problem Richard Wilson has always had is that he needs to build guns in the UK, so he cannot import complete S&W revolvers and then later sell them as Sec.1 and S&W won't well him parts. So that's a different situation to Ghost's Glock or a Merkle LBR.
JSC wrote:Seems black and white to me. I know there are several Merkle LBRs in the UK built from S&W revolvers. Do we know of any forces refusing to allow those on ticket? Over the years I've heard a lot of stories but hard facts are hard to come by, as usual...
It would seem to me that if a Sec.5 gun crosses the border into the UK then from that point it's going to be classed as Sec. 5 for ever, regardless of what's done to it, but if someone in a far away land makes a Sec. 1 gun out of whatever bits and pieces are available to them, then you're buying a Sec.1 gun.
The problem Richard Wilson has always had is that he needs to build guns in the UK, so he cannot import complete S&W revolvers and then later sell them as Sec.1 and S&W won't well him parts. So that's a different situation to Ghost's Glock or a Merkle LBR.
Or have I missed something?
The way i understand it is the same as JSC, its how it comes into the UK. So you can't modify a Sec 5 into a sec 1. That raises all sorts of questions over where the barrel went etc.
I have a few friends with S&W LBR's but they come into the UK with the conversions already done.
Well if someone in the US (for example) is buying a new Glock, making a 12.5'' .22 barrel for it, modifying the slide, coating it, adding a "coathanger", then exporting it, and getting it proofed here, you can be sure its not going to be cheap...
At a very rough guess I'd say you won't be far away from £2k each.
Talking about the rod out the back... how can you make a metal rod "non-removable" from a polymer frame..? Surely a relatively small amount of brute force will make it removable, something the HO won't allow...
Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Glocks... I handed a M21 and M17 in during the 97 confiscation, and I'd love a Glock LBP, but so many, as yet, unanswered questions...
SO much confusion and secret squirrel on this thread the paranoia is off the chart! 