Identification Please

[Tony]

Hello
I have just purchased a percussion rifle from an auction house, knowing absolutely nothing about percussion rifles

Black powder is something that I would like to understand more, but family commitments may mean active participation is in the future

This rifle is for novelty value nothing more, but I am fascinated just holding it and wondering about it's history

I cannot see any engraving anywhere so I am thinking this may be a very basic model, mass produced, which may indicate that it was used in conflict

Also, looking online I cannot see any pictures of a hammer being retained by a nut, all have a screw, so is this the result of a repair, which again does that suggest heavy use in the past?

Apologies for the mixed units, but it is the only equipment I have, the muzzle is 19mm in diameter and the barrel from the opening to the nipple is 22.5 inches
There is a heavy stamping on the barrel of 1853 and a smaller stamping of 2192 on the barrel and the stock
I can't see any riffling in the bore, so I was wondering if it would have been only light to begin with, or could this be a shotgun?

Thank you
Tony

[dromia]

Looks like a bitzer, the lock doesn't seem to fit the stock, in fact from the photograph it looks expoxied in.

Snail is rotten, replacement lock and probably different hammer, could be based on a P53 rifled musket but hard to tell if it was ever rifled from the state of the bore.

P53 had progressive rifling but still quiet prominent at the muzzle.

Cleaning it up would be a nice learning exercise and it could be made into a wall hanger depending 'pon taste.

How ever under no circumstances would I consider firing such a thing.

Hope you only paid a few bob for it.

Either that or it is an as new example of the mythological Asperley Aimless muzzle loader.

[Tony]

Thank you for your reply dromia, rest assured I have no intention of firing it, it is purely a conversation piece

You mentioned cleaning it up as an exercise, would that be just a light cleaning keeping the patina or would you suggest exposing the original timber and recoating it with something and what would you suggest for the barrel?

Tony

[dromia]

I am no fan myself of trying undo that which has taken decades and centuries of wear and use to achieve, but 'tis your gun and you can do with it what you will.

Trying to make an old gun look new is a total oxymoron to me.

I would just give it a good clean and strip first of all and the see what it "said" to me.

[Tony]

Thank you, I will do as you say

[1066]

I thinks that's definitely a bitza - Lock certainly not made with the stock - the whole thing looks "Eastern" However if you're interested in the history of arms or how these old guns were made, then this is a good place to start, you can't do any harm and it might spark further interest. Although that is a very crude example, similar muskets/rifles were in common use from around 1810 -1850.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4UUVMS-pzQ

[Tony]

Having been intrigued with not finding any pictures on Google with a nut securing the hammer and then removing the nut, I could see it was not owing to a previous repair, but by design and so I investigated further

Thank you to 1066 for providing the link, I found it and other Konyak Naga videos very interesting, including the construction of a hammer with the same nut as mine

So, this is my humble opinion based on what I can see and what I have found:
From looking at the Konyak Naga videos I think someone got hold of an Enfield 1853 and copied it as best they could. I have found pictures of the Enfield 1853 lock mechanism and they look very similar to mine

It is pure speculation, but I would not be surprised if the person copying the stock was not the same person creating the lock mechanism and several stocks were made before it was realised that there was a mismatch between the stock, the lock and trigger guard.

One of the reasons I think this is original is because of the same number, 2192 on the barrel and the stock. It has 1853 stamped on the barrel, but that might be infringement of copyright, it also has a number stamped on the stock in a very large font, so was this actually supplied to some military?

I could supply photos of my conclusions, but don’t think it would help

In conclusion, I do not believe this is assembled from a box of bits, but is original in it’s construction, I am not sure how safe it ever was, I would hope the Quality Assurance Department would have tested every rifle with a load greater than the recommended load and rejected any failures

As I said, a very rough example and for some reason unknown to Google
Thank you for reading this

[1066]

I'm pleased to see you've done some further research - it's certainly an interesting subject (to me at least). Having another look at the photo of the lock, it seems to me that the geometry isn't quite right. The relationship between the hammer and nipple seem quite wrong.

I've recently been shown another percussion pistol. The chap who bought it was convinced it was worth a fortune - Unfortunately an almost worthless fake.

[Tony]

It does look genuine to a novice

This is photo with the securing bolt removed, it sits a lot better don't you think?

[Tony]

The reverse side of the lock