The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

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ovenpaa
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The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#1 Post by ovenpaa »

We ran a mini comparative on four different kinds of cleaning agent earlier this month to see how they compared. The test was simple, coat sets of identical make bullets pre-weighed to two decimal places in four different makes of copper cleaner and record the results. A simple test however deep down I knew it was never going to be enough so this is the result of a ten product/ten day test.

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Interesting stuff eh? Well hopefully so with some background. The reason for the test is I was asked if I would be interested in acting as an outlet for a new UK produced cleaning product and before I was truly going to commit there were a few things to settle. Was it UK produced, did it work and would we put the SHED name to it, anyway back to the test.

Ten groups of three 155 grain SMK's were segregated into matched sets weighed to two decimal places and degreased in acetone, then ten containers had an equal amount of solvent added to each container, this operation was carried out by the Viking who numbered and noted separately by number 1-10 what was in each container. I had no idea what was in each container however two of them obviously had foam in them so that narrowed those two down somewhat. Just prior to adding the bullets I tested and noted the pH of the contents of each container, the bullets were then added, the lids closed and the contents agitated, the containers were opened and then agitated every four waking hours and photographed periodically.

At the end of the ten day period the bullets were removed from the containers, washed by hand in hot soapy water, followed by acetone then dried and photographed and that is the first picture in this post. The bullets are numbered L-R top row first with top L being #1 etc.

Firstly the products revealed, with a short code identifier and the pH where 1 is Acidic and 14 is Alkaline with a pH7 being neutral.

1 Hoppes No 9 (H9) pH6
2 Hoppes Elite (HE) pH9
3 KG 12 Bore Cleaner (KG) pH13
4 Napier Solvent (NS) pH6
5 Shooter's Choice (SC) pH5
6 Benchrest 9 (BR9) pH6
7 C2R Copper & Carbon Remover (C2R) pH9
8 Parker Hale 009 (PH9) pH6
9 Wipe Out Bore Foam : Copper Only (WOF) pH10
10 Forrest MilFoam (MFF) pH10

Let me say at this stage that I did not see the striking copper loss shown in previous tests with KG 12, this is one thing I found very odd. I have run tests with KG 12 on three occasions now and at no stage did the product show the impressive copper stripping I had expected. The KG 12 I use is now some 3-4 months old and is stored sealed in a darkened environment which is the same as the other products so I am at a loss to explain this with the possible exception of heat, my tests were carried out in the kitchen which I doubt goes above 22C this time of year, maybe running the test at 32C would give a more marked impact however this is England.... One other thing which fascinated me is the appearance of vertical striations radiating from the meplat on sample 7 Look closely and you will see them, I can only assume this is part of the jacket closing process.

Now the results in table form.The weight loss is recorded in grains and is on a per bullet basis

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The amount of copper removed in grains from the test groups of bullets, remember these were sets of three SMK 155's and this gives a good indication of the effectiveness of the products. The scale on the left is grains and with products in order 1-10 along the bottom, in this graph more is better as it means the product removed more grains of copper

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Now a comparison of the approximate cost of cleaning solvent to remove 1 grain of copper fouling from the barrel, the scale on the left is GBP with products in order 1-10 along the bottom, in this graph less is better as it means the product cost is less for each grain of copper removed.

Image

So what did we learn from this test?

The first thing that springs to mind is what exactly are some of the products supposed to do? I get the impression one of them is rather good at preserving bullets as opposed to stripping copper, one of them, well I certainly would not get it on my hands, and yes the product we were testing came out tops despite our utmost to be totally unbiased, so are the Viking and I convinced of the worth of the product? The easy answer is very much so. I have sat down and cleaned maybe a dozen rifles over the last few weeks, some were known clean rifles and yet still more came out of them. Others were filthy dirty old service rifles that I simply stuck in a cradle in the corner of the workshop, dosed with the new product and then went back to machining only pausing to swab the bore out when I remembered or needed a break. At every stage it has exceeded my expectations and meanwhile others have been reporting back with nothing less than glowing reports. The product strips copper, strips carbon, seemed to get under the lead fouling on one rifle and left the bore of my P14 shinier than I have ever seen it.

I am 100% convinced now however I have a cunning plan for one more test. We are going to take the top 5 products from both tests, soak for 24 hours and weigh to see if any one product is especially effective during this first period.

Then to try and replicate the process of swabbing out which adds some form of mechanical abrasion (At no stage in any of my cleaning have I used a brush) I will drop 3 weighed bullets into individual containers with measured doses of product, add half a dozen patches, seal the containers up and bung them in a tumbler for a few hours to vaguely simulate the process of swabbing out with a clean patch, the idea being the rattling around with soaked patches will go some way to replicating a patch being passed through a fouled barrel. What will it show us? I truthfully have no idea however I am sure it will be interesting.

To be continued...

I nearly forgot, the name of the new product? C2R
/d

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Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#2 Post by 20series »

Excellent write up David :goodjob:

Alan
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M99

Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#3 Post by M99 »

Very interesting results - I look forward to trying it out eventually!

Mike
Sandyman

Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#4 Post by Sandyman »

Very interesting and useful. While we are on the topic of cleaning any one got any preferences/advice for cleaning .50's

Tony
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Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#5 Post by johngarnett »

Well done David, an eye opener :goodjob:

Now on my 'must have' list!

JohnG :cornwall:
Last edited by johngarnett on Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#6 Post by ovenpaa »

Sandyman wrote:Very interesting and useful. While we are on the topic of cleaning any one got any preferences/advice for cleaning .50's

Tony
Tony, I have sent a sample to Mike however he is using excuses like snow and weather to avoid range time with his new rifle, my suspicion is he has adopted the 'Only shoot on days without clouds' approach. Also known as the Viking school of shooting....
/d

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M99

Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#7 Post by M99 »

ovenpaa wrote:
Sandyman wrote:Very interesting and useful. While we are on the topic of cleaning any one got any preferences/advice for cleaning .50's

Tony
Tony, I have sent a sample to Mike however he is using excuses like snow and weather to avoid range time with his new rifle, my suspicion is he has adopted the 'Only shoot on days without clouds' approach. Also known as the Viking school of shooting....
You cheeky git! - The Mrs is having issues stopping me trying it out at home! - I am sure the rabbits won't mind ;)

Tony - just use the Robin school of thought - don't clean it until it breaks! then send it off to get fixed.

Clean your 50 the same as you do your 308 mate - I treat all mine the same. You are going to need a VERY long cleaning rod though 50 inches or so, as barrel, chamber and break come to 48"!

Mike
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Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#8 Post by ovenpaa »

I did see some 60" cleaning rod guides listed in one of spreadsheets so shout if you get stuck plus I have a load of jags, brushes and patches for .50BMG
/d

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M99

Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#9 Post by M99 »

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Dougan

Re: The Shooting SHED ten day bore cleaning comparative.

#10 Post by Dougan »

Excellent experiment, write-up and photos :goodjob:

I know this test was for copper, but I can confirm that Milfoam isn't very effective generally - A few years ago I bought a Winchester Under-leaver - the previous owner had been using .38, and as I wanted to use .357 had to get rid of the carbon ring in the throat - The bore foam was left for hours, but just didn't touch it...in the end I had to soak it in 009 (jammed soaked patches against the marks for several hours) and scrub...and this did completely clear it.

It's interesting that the CR2 was most effective, but not at either end of the PH scale...and as you mention, there are a few there that I wouldn't want to get in any cracks or cuts on the hands...

This new stuff looks perfect for TR and F/TR, where quality modern barrels are used, and I will certainly get some to try on the Swing...

...however, a question: As this stuff is effective at removing copper from barrels that were previously thought to be clean; is there any problem with using it on older service rifles that have a bit of pitting...could it actually clean them too much, leading to degradation?

One application where I can see this being very handy, is cleaning at the range - I tend not to as my cleaning regime is time consuming and far easier done on a bench...however if you were putting a lot of bullet downrange on the same day (as you can in F/TR comps) then this stuff could make even a quick rod through effective....
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